Bass Bridge Alternative für Rickenbacker-Style Bass

[Lynx Krueger]

Okay, also, ich hab mich zu nem Rickenfaker-Style Kit von Guitarkitfabric.co.uk hinreißen lassen.
Von der Qualität bin ich echt überrascht, gerade für den Preis von 190 Pfund + Versand.
Einzige Mankos sind der Jazz Pickup Route, für die Btidge und dass keine Ricky, sondern MuMa Bridge dabei sind aber ein größeres Loch zu fräsen ist ja kein Problem.

Das Brückenmanko stört mich schon ein wenig.
Ich hab daher vorübergenend eine Hipshot A-Style Bridge drauf geschnallt. Die ist aber natürlich ein Fender-Replacement und sieht einfach mit der Korpusform nicht richtig aus.
Hab mir also eine LYWS/Wilkinson Ricky-Style Bridge, wie sie auf den Harley Benton Bässen drauf ist gekauft - super-massiv und vom Setup her wär sie wohl perfekt, aber dadurch dass die Saitenreiter dort sitzen, wo beim richtigen Ricky der Mute sitzt, passt die Brücke nicht.

Wenn ich sie der Mensur (34" nicht echte Rickenbacker Mensur, ein weiterer positiver Punkt von dem Kit für mich) entsprechend montiere, steht sie leider ziemlich über - wir sprechen hier von ca. 2 cm.
Das geht natürlich nicht... Aber die Brücke kommt definitiv mal auf nen anderen bass drauf!

Natürlich gibt's die AllParts Ricky Bridge, aber für die müsste ich einerseits wieder fräsen, und darüber hinaus ist das Teil schon ziemlich fadenscheiniger Druckguss.
Ich suche also nach einer Alternative.


Hab schon überlegt mir eine aus ner Alu-Grundplatte und nem angeschraubten Alublock selbst zu bauen, ähnlich von der Konstruktion wie ne Ibanez ATK Bridge, nur halt mit massiverem Tail-Piece Klotz...
Einziges Problem ist dass ich nicht weiß ob ich günstig an ne Aluplatte in den richtigen Dimensionen ran komm... Und das is halt auch wieder Rumgewerke - werde ich mal im Hinterkopf behalten, aber momentan suche ich eher ne vorgefertigte Lösung.

Es muss auch keine 1:1 Rickenbacker Brücke sien, nur was das massiger ist als die A-Style bridge...
Hat jemand eine Idee?

 

[MauMau]

Servus,
die hast du nicht erwähnt, wäre aber wohl das naheliegendste:
Hipshot Rick-Replacement
Oder basst die von der Position dann auch nicht?
Edith meint noch, dass du dann mehr Kohle in die Brücke gesteckt hättest als in dne gesamten Rest - u.U. ein Schmarrn.

 

[Lynx Krueger]

@MauMau Hehe - ja genau - also wenn ich nicht eine gebrauchte Hipshot Rickenbacker Brücke für sagen wir mal max. 100 Euro finde, dann ist das keine Alternative.
Die A-Style Bridge hatte ich defakto rumliegen, aber eine neue Hipshot Brücke für mehr als den Bass ... ich glaub nicht.

 

[kodiakblair]

It doesn't have to be a 1:1 Rickenbacker bridge either,

A Rickenbacker bridge will look odd due to the scale length.

Here is the standard Ric-a-like bridge fitted to a 34" scale length Harley Benton.

And here we have a Ric bridge placed for 34" scale length.

If it were me , I would just fit a Schaller 3D

 

[Lynx Krueger]

A Rickenbacker bridge will look odd due to the scale length.

Here is the standard Ric-a-like bridge fitted to a 34" scale length Harley Benton.

Anhang anzeigen 590734

And here we have a Ric bridge placed for 34" scale length.

Anhang anzeigen 590735

If it were me , I would just fit a Schaller 3D

Hey @kodiakblair,

Your photoshopped Rickenbacker bridge is a bit deceiving, as it isn't the right size, which becomes becomes quite evident when following the string paths.
Admittedly the perspective is not the same, but if you flip it upside down and position it by the center of the strings to match the spacing of the HB's bridge, it is close to the size of the HB's bridge and much closer towards the neck.
I do have that exact bridge and it won't fit on my bass, because the saddles points are further towards the front on the HB's bridge, pretty much in the place where the Rickenbacker bridge has its mutes.
My 34" Rickenbacker copy, just has a longer scale neck and the same size body as a normal Rickenbacker 4003, this bridge would have to move further back and over the edge of the body so it protrudes by about 2 cm to acchieve the correct scale length.

This is the difference in positioning that would be necessary, so on my bass it would look like this - the orange line roughly shows is the 34" scale length, green is the original bridge positining and red the HB-Style bridge:

Not an option for me.
I was thinking of using a Schaller 3D Bridge with an added aluminum tail piece to get the Rickenbacker bridge shape. Let's say it's a possibility, but I'd rather put on something prefabricated.

 

[kodiakblair]

Your photoshopped Rickenbacker bridge is a bit deceiving, as it isn't the right size,

The point of the graphic is to show how far forward the Ric saddles force the bridge to sit.

That is what the photo shows . The pictured bass was 864mm scale length so the saddles for both bridges were placed in the correct positions .



The faker bridges are 98.5mm long x 92.5mm wide. Rickenbacker bridges are 101mm long x 98mm wide.

There is roughly 30mm from the front of a Ric bridge to the saddles. Does your kit have 70mm of body left behind the saddles ?

 

[Lynx Krueger]

I don't have it here at the moment to measure, as the second coat of paint is still in the process of drying but my faker bridge is about the dimensions you name.
On that bridge the intonation points are about 8 cm from the rear end.
I measured the scale length on the bass put the bridge where it is supposed to be and it protruded by about 2 cm - so no, I guess it's more about 6 cm of space.

I guess I could have adjusted for that by glueing the neck in a bit further out, but with the neck pocket being very deep and the remaining wood very thin, I didn't want to take any chance on string tension pulling it forward without being anchored against the body at the heel.

Also, I'm guessing that regardless of that, the bridge position will shift from that of a real Rickenbacker due to the neck being longer.
But I don't have one here for comparison.

Will measure again when I get it back.

 

[kodiakblair]

@Lynx Krueger

Moving the neck is far too much work just to accommodate a bridge Go with the Schaller, it's a far better design

 

[Lynx Krueger]

@Lynx Krueger

Moving the neck is far too much work just to accommodate a bridge Go with the Schaller, it's a far better design

Oh yes I agree - I meant I could have done so when originally setting the neck. Since now it's already been painted there is no going back anyway.
I guess, I will be going with the Hipshot A-Style Bridge I already have - lets me set the spacing too and it's a lot more massive than the Schaller.

 

[Lynx Krueger]

Okay, ich hab den Halswinkel verkackt.
Obwohl ich zweimal gemessen hab vor dem Einleimen und mit der besprochenen A-Style Bridge bei geradem Hals und unterster Saitenreitereinstellung diese genau plan mit dem Griffbrett waren ist jetzt in fertigem Zustand bei planen Saitenreitern die Saitenlage am 12. Bund 2.5 mm. Das ist eher suboptimal.

Keine Ahnung was ich da gemacht hab, vielleicht war der Hals beim Messen nicht ganz in der Tasche - ich weiß es nicht.

@kodiakblair Ich hätte daher die Frage, wie tief die Allparts Rickenbacker Bridge über der Korpusoberfäche eingestellt werden kann.
Kannst du mir da vielleicht helfen?

Wenn alle stricke reißen, und es passt, würde ich einfach in den Sauren Apfel beißen, mir so eine kaufen.

Den Hals mag ich vorerst nicht wieder runter nehmen - wobei das natürlich auch ein recht lustiges Projekt werden könnte...

 

[kodiakblair]

@@kodiakblair I would therefore like to ask how low the Allparts Rickenbacker Bridge can be set above the body surface.
can you help me with that?

I'm afraid the Rickenbacker bridges sit higher.

Minimum string height with an A style bridge is 10mm from the body. It is at least 14mm on the Rickenbacker.

As shimming the neck is not an option , the only solution is sink the bridge into the body.

 

[Lynx Krueger]

Yeah, I thought so...
I guess I'll try removing the neck then - always wanted to do that anyway =D

 

[kodiakblair]

I guess I'll try removing the neck then

I've built several basses, that is not a method I'd recommend. I would rebate the bridge into the body.

Rebate is an easier, quicker and you have a better chance of a successful outcome.

 

[Lynx Krueger]

I know it's tricky, but with sinking the bridge into the body, the strings would be even closer to the top and the pickups, which are pretty much to the deck as is.
Also that will probably even more dampen the basses sound...

I'm not really attached to this bass to begin with, it's a kit and I just bought it as a project.
It's main use for me is to have something to work on and the more things I can try with it, the better.

Also, it really shouldn't be that hard. All I should need is an iron a cork mat and one or two foam cutters, score the finish at the separation lines, drill tiny holes to the side of the neck pocket, which I can do in the pickup cavity so they're invisible and then wait for the heat to work the glue loose, maybe help with a thin pallet knife.

The wood under the neck pocket is so thin, it really shouldn'd take too long for the glue to heat up enough to loosen and if I ruin the finish, which admittedly is a possibility, I just sand the back off and re-spray.
That will also give me a chance to improve my painting skills...
The only thing I'm not sure about is whether it would need one of those jigs that push the neck up with a screw. That might make things easier but I doubt the mechanics would apply for a set neck.

 

[kodiakblair]

I know it's tricky, but with sinking the bridge into the body, the strings would be even closer to the top and the pickups, which are pretty much to the deck as is.

Hi, please accept my apologises but there's something I'm not grasping here.

Earlier you posted that string height at 12th fret was 2.5mm and sub-optimal. Rightly or wrongly I took this to mean too high. With a bolt-on design the easy fix would be shim the neck pocket but with set neck/neck through the options are replace bridge for lower profile or sink the bridge.

Your reply saying the present bridge is at it's lowest setting yet the strings are close to the top/pickups , sinking the bridge will only worsen the problem.

This is where I'm confused. Pickup cavities are normally 19mm deep. Overall height for a jazz single coil is 19mm , for a split-P it's 14mm ; the mini toaster humbuckers sit in the middle at 17mm including the plate. Apart from the PG mounted toaster, springs/foam are needed to push them above the body surface Since the Type A bridge has a minimum string height of 10mm and the Rick 14mm there should be plenty of room below the strings.

Have you checked the depth of the nut slots ? If they are cut too high, 3 passes with a file will lower your string height and save you a huge amount of work.

I'll keep my fingers crossed that the nut is too high

 

[Lynx Krueger]

Sorry - yes this is a bit

The issue is not mainly the distance of the strings above the pickups. Those I could still drop a little.
Also the bass is by far not unplayable.

The problem is I cannot drop the strings at the bridge, because the saddles are already to the deck, with an action of 2,5 mm at the 12th fret.

Because the neck angle is apparently further tilted forwards now than it was when I measured before glueing (maybe the neck heel got stuck and I didn't notice, it was a rather tight fit in the neck pocket)
it is now not tilted back as it should be.

Yes, 2.5 mm at the 12th fret isn't that high, but I usually prefer it a smidge below 2.

However, due to the neck not tilting back but actually a bit forward (I have no clue how this is even possible), the strings are too close to the top/pickguard already and falling off towards the bridge.
about 14 mm at the neck joint, and 11 mm at the bridge.
I have heard that the very thin neck pocked and heel have had the effect of the neck practically caving in in some Ibanez Rickenbacker copies, but it doesn't look like this is happening here.


If I now, with the already wrong neck angle additionally sank the bridge into the body, that would perhaps solve the adjustability issue, but I would get the strings very close to the top of the bass.
In my experience that's not only uncomfortable to play but negatively affects the sound of the instrument.

The saddle slots are indeed still a bit high as i only roughed it in at this point, but by far not high enough to compensate for the problem.
I could maybe shave off .25 mm tops and that would give maybe .5 mm at the 12th fret. But that still doesn't give me any adjustability.

Hope this makes it clearer - otherwise I think I'll have to take pictures.

So even with all that considered, taking the neck of still seems to be the best way to fix the admittedly flawed geometry of the bass to me.
It's my first set neck, so I expected some complications, and as mentioned before, it's more about the journey that about the instrument.